Bit Blot Forum
Aquaria => Modding => Topic started by: FrancesF on March 23, 2012, 10:56:12 pm
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Labyrinth Mod is finished! :D Download here:
http://fg.wzff.de/pub/aquaria/mods/Labyrinth_v1.zip (http://j.mp/GNqzPC)
Please feel free to contact me with feedback on your gameplaying experience. Or post feedback here on the forum. :)
False.Genesis suggests: Linux people should get the latest build (March 17th) because previous versions fail to load custom particle effects and shots properly.
Mac people should also upgrade. The mod does run on the older versions, but crashes sometimes, especially on the bosses. Tried everything to get this working properly, but it's an unpredictable engine bug, that even hits on 1.1.1 on windows sometimes.
Download new versions here: http://www.bit-blot.com/forum/index.php?topic=4313.0
Labyrinth Mod is primarily an exploration adventure which takes place over a couple of days shortly after the ending of the main game. There are treasures to find, mazes to explore, and enemies to fight! Enjoy!
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Awesome! I'm not sure if I'll have time to try it the next days, but I'm certainly looking forward to this. :)
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I've just fired it up! It looks awesome and can't wait to play more. ;D
2 things,
The volume control on my headset controls Naija!
Also, double clicking does not bring up the map... what have I done wrong?
Thanks again for sharing this... back to the Labyrinth... :D
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Also, double clicking does not bring up the map... what have I done wrong?
The old version does not support world maps in mods (but there is a workaround script on this forum).
Even though the new version does support them, what point does a labyrinth with a world map have? :D
(Though, sometime while talking on skype we had a discussion whether to add a partial world map of some sorts, but decided against it.)
The volume control on my headset controls Naija!
Is it an USB headset by chance? Because if i use the volume control buttons on my keyboard, the same thing happens... but this is how the game handles input. Not related to the mod at all. ;)
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The old version does not support world maps in mods (but there is a workaround script on this forum).
Even though the new version does support them, what point does a labyrinth with a world map have? :D
(Though, sometime while talking on skype we had a discussion whether to add a partial world map of some sorts, but decided against it.)
;D Makes sense, wouldn't have asked, except that the dialogue in game said to double click on the map to see more... ;)
Is it an USB headset by chance? Because if i use the volume control buttons on my keyboard, the same thing happens... but this is how the game handles input. Not related to the mod at all. ;)
Yes it is, and it had been the first time I'd seen it...
I've only had about an hour to play, but I'm really enjoying your hard work! Thanks again for sharing... and responding.
Muchas Gracias!
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Wow. This mod is really something special.
I've only had time to put about 33 minutes into the mod (college life is busy and hectic :) ), but what I've seen is pretty great.
Just a few random comments:
You should know that it took me about 33 minutes to find the first song. That Bind song was a tricky one! Pretty obscure location, too. Didn't even think to look there.
Also, putting some of the most dangerous creatures in Aquaria in the first stage alone? Nearly got killed a few times because of those worms with saw mouths and sharks. And the freakin' crabs. Made the wall-jumping frustrating.
On the plus side, the mod looks absolutely beautiful! There's plenty of eye candy, and the use of colors and different wildlife is certainly pleasing.
On the whole, a pretty interesting first impression, and I look forward to playing the rest!
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Yes, I am really enjoying this!
Was wondering if I've done something wrong? - says I have found 3 costumes but only two show.
EDIT: My bad :-[ didn't realize there were 2 pages.
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Fun times! :D
http://oi39.tinypic.com/35c22k7.jpg
http://oi44.tinypic.com/j9u13s.jpg
Don't worry; I'm reporting all bugs to fgenesis via IRC. Very nice mod so far. Bravo! I just have the tendency to abuse anything until I find glitches so I feel better. :)
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Well, I'm 7 hours in.. and have thoroughly enjoyed the Labyrinth you have shared with us... (still have a few challenges to solve!)
It has been familiar enough to be comfortable, and devious enough to truly engage!
I have enjoyed your art... and wish to show my respect to you and your cohorts / enablers!
Thanks again for helping Aquaria to live on... ;D
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Thanks, Gringamuyloca. I'm glad you enjoyed playing! And it's great to get feedback. :)
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So far, I've been giving my feedback to fg on IRC, but time to give credit where it's due.
Awesome job! I've been thinking over the past few months how I wish more of Aquaria were like the first half hour or so. The song cave is my favorite part of the game. And you've gone and made a mod where, so far, the WHOLE THING is like the part of Aquaria I love the most. The mazes are all different and very well thought out, and the artwork is amazing. It fits excellently with the whole Aquaria universe, and so far it's just plain brilliant. Love it!
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Uploaded a new zip with slight bugfixes as reported by Daxar, thanks!
If you have already downloaded the first release there is no need to update.
EDIT: Got a few more minor bugs in the scripts, but still nothing critical, will fix them when i have time (thx again Daxar for reporting)
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Oh man! :D Could someone do a Let's Play of this? I'm not sure if I have time to try it out right now, but I really want to see what it's about.
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CHALLENGE. ACCEPTED.
EDIT: YouTube playlist for the LP here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utewI-zmdxo&list=PLF17ACDF4D514BBBC&index=1&feature=plpp_video).
I've got parts 1-14 uploaded so far, more coming 'soon'.
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Uploaded Labyrinth v1.1 which fixes some important bugs;
I recommend everyone to download the new version.
The download link is the same (see first post) - but the new zip has a changelog file in it.
Pearlmine:
- Sunform cave: Added darkness so the particle effect flash doesn't show underneath the layer 8 border rocks.
- Fixed wooden door getting destroyed when hit by a laser.
- Fixed entities getting stuck after defeating the boss.
- Replaced small rocks with nudi shells - causes less stuttering when loading the map.
Wheel:
- Fish form is now required to leave the map. (If the map is left without fish form, the ending scene is not triggered)
- Fixed permanently respawning singbulb (2 special cakes) near the pearlmine lens.
Special thx to Daxar for pointing out most of the bugs that creeped up so far ;)
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Greetings to all of you who downloaded Labyrinth Mod! Now that you may have had a chance to play it, I would love to know what you think of it – what parts you liked best :D, what parts you didn't like :P, what you think could be improved...
Thanks so much,
Frances
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I've made a poster quality image of the central wheel maze of the mod from 100+ screenshots. Of course it's a huge spoiler! Naija makes 20 appearances – I think a little kid would have lots of fun finding them all! You can download the image here:
(http://fg.wzff.de/images/misc/aq/wheel_small.jpg) (http://fg.wzff.de/images/misc/aq/labyrinth/wheel.jpg)
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I WILL play it, promised. Just not in the next two weeks. After that, I have only little time, not no time. ;)
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Scaled down & recompressed preview follows:
(Because the original 10200 x 10200 take a lot of RAM to display!)
(http://fg.wzff.de/images/misc/aq/wheel_small.jpg) (http://fg.wzff.de/images/misc/aq/labyrinth/wheel.jpg)
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Hey, I'd like some feedback from folks who've played Labyrinth Mod – should the world map be enabled? Or would it be too much of a spoiler?
(And any other feedback would also be appreciated!) :D
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Yeah, my feedback gone very late, after ~3 weeks of when playing was finished)) Design and bosses are very cool, and I enjoyed whole this mod! Thank you devs)) I opened PNG of map with lizards for fast understanding where needing to swim) Of course I saw some symbols on beginning of map but not fully got idea of them) It's only place where map is really needed, so my vote against of world map of all levels!
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Aww, c'mon. The symbols were easy. One meant up, the other down. Just a bit of trial and error and you can figure it out pretty quickly yourself. Then write it down and follow along as you're swimming.
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Hey, I'd like some feedback from folks who've played Labyrinth Mod – should the world map be enabled? Or would it be too much of a spoiler?
(And any other feedback would also be appreciated!) :D
I'm terribly sorry that I still haven't played it, Frances. Atm it feels as if my day has only 20 hours and the (mostly) tranquil waters of Naija's world is far away...
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Well, False Genesis got me interested in trying this, so why not. I've only just started, I haven't found anything except a turtle egg and lots of plants to sing at to give me recipes so far, so this is very early first impressions I'll give.
First, I want to ask though - I can't use the world map. I know mods typically can't, but does that mean I'm not using the most up to date version of the mod? The first few posts in this topic made me unsure of that. I would like to be able to use it, if there's a way - mostly as a way to keep track of where I have been and where I haven't. Not having a map to use in things like this makes things a lot more tedious for me, so if it's at all possible...
But impressions - I am absolutely impressed with the art and aesthetics and visual style of the locations I've seen, it's really pretty, especially what is done with the plant life and coral and such around - the really long strands of green seaweed or something similar to the kelp forest's type of plant life was pretty impressive. What's also really impressed me, is that it's not just copy and pasted assets from the original campaign - I'm pretty sure there are some things in here that are entirely new.
And I think I found what is supposed to be Naija/Li's new home - I really like what is done with this, with individual rooms and places for them to rest and sit down, it really feels like they are trying to just enjoy a casual home life and everything.
I also like that you bothered including narration for Naija - obviously it's not voiced, but that you do have moments where she says something, even if it's just text. I was worried that something like that wouldn't be included in this and Naija would lose some of her personality in the translation to a mod.
But, criticism - I feel things are a bit *too* aimless. Yes, Aquaria is about an open world and exploring, but even the main game of Aquaria gives you *some* sense of direction - I feel like, if nothing else, you should at least be given some kind of idea from the start, where Naija/Li's home is at.
Also, it's too difficult! Just swimming around this area, I can't even sing a shield spell, yet I'm running into *multiples* of those worms with teeth that chase me around and can box me into a tunnel making it impossible to get out - and I can't even stock up on healing supplies? This is a little ridiculous - I don't feel that Aquaria should be a game based around this kind of difficulty - I've always found Aquaria to be a highly relaxing game that was never too frustrating or difficult, and was more about just enjoying exploring and such - it wasn't meant to be Super Ghouls and Ghosts, basically. Which is an exaggeration of the difficulty, but I'm trying to make a point.
I think, especially in the first area, before you get any real way to defend yourself, should have almost no threats. Look at the Home Waters, for example.
I'll keep playing though, and come back with more thoughts later.
Oh, one last thing, about the story, I'm a bit nervous about it because I absolutely hate the original extended ending, and I kindof feel that it's so flawed, anything that tries to build from it, will also be flawed, as it's just such an out of place, and out of character downer ending, but we'll see what I think of this, if I think it's well done at least, as I get through it.
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First, I want to ask though - I can't use the world map. I know mods typically can't, but does that mean I'm not using the most up to date version of the mod? The first few posts in this topic made me unsure of that. I would like to be able to use it, if there's a way - mostly as a way to keep track of where I have been and where I haven't. Not having a map to use in things like this makes things a lot more tedious for me, so if it's at all possible...
No, there isn't any newer version of the mod out right now.
But you're not the first one saying this. We might, as a consensus, add a worldmap for the first map, and keep the rest of the labyrinth in the dark. Have to see.
I'm pretty sure there are some things in here that are entirely new.
Heh, wait until you see the other maps, Frances has drawn almost everything in these herself ;)
But, criticism - I feel things are a bit *too* aimless. Yes, Aquaria is about an open world and exploring, but even the main game of Aquaria gives you *some* sense of direction - I feel like, if nothing else, you should at least be given some kind of idea from the start, where Naija/Li's home is at.
The home, except for the garden, isn't too important actually. The whole point of the first map is to stock up on some resources and find shield and bind - to be ready for the actual labyrinth.
Also, it's too difficult! Just swimming around this area, I can't even sing a shield spell, yet I'm running into *multiples* of those worms with teeth that chase me around and can box me into a tunnel making it impossible to get out - and I can't even stock up on healing supplies?
Yep, the worms are annoying, I agree. Just be fast and don't let them corner you.
Healing supplies? There's many plants in the garden, and many fish to harvest. That said:
Leaf + Leaf = Leaf Poultice
Leaf + Meat = Hand Roll
Hand Roll + Oil = Tasty Roll
etc etc -- the recipes haven't changed :)
Hopefully this helps a bit.
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No, there isn't any newer version of the mod out right now.
But you're not the first one saying this. We might, as a consensus, add a worldmap for the first map, and keep the rest of the labyrinth in the dark. Have to see.
Ah, alright. Personally - I would suggest making it an option, if possible. Give the choice to the player - if they are a purist for dungeons, and want real difficulty and to figure things out themselves, have an option to not have a worldmap. If they want more guidance and help, let them turn a worldmap on.
If this can't be done via an option, perhaps you could simply release two versions of the mod - one with a worldmap and one without? I *assume* that's not too difficult to do *if* you can get a world map working in the first place, but I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on this subject.
I'm pretty sure there are some things in here that are entirely new.
Heh, wait until you see the other maps, Frances has drawn almost everything in these herself ;)
Wow, that's honestly really impressive. Serious props for that.
But, criticism - I feel things are a bit *too* aimless. Yes, Aquaria is about an open world and exploring, but even the main game of Aquaria gives you *some* sense of direction - I feel like, if nothing else, you should at least be given some kind of idea from the start, where Naija/Li's home is at.
The home, except for the garden, isn't too important actually. The whole point of the first map is to stock up on some resources and find shield and bind - to be ready for the actual labyrinth.
It's not about it being "important", it's just about about a basic sense of direction.
Also, it's too difficult! Just swimming around this area, I can't even sing a shield spell, yet I'm running into *multiples* of those worms with teeth that chase me around and can box me into a tunnel making it impossible to get out - and I can't even stock up on healing supplies?
Yep, the worms are annoying, I agree. Just be fast and don't let them corner you.
Healing supplies? There's many plants in the garden, and many fish to harvest. That said:
Leaf + Leaf = Leaf Poultice
Leaf + Meat = Hand Roll
Hand Roll + Oil = Tasty Roll
etc etc -- the recipes haven't changed :)
Hopefully this helps a bit.
I don't have songs to let me pull up those plants and harvest the fish, yet I can still run into these powerful enemies. I'm hoping the mod is just this difficult because it's the start and I don't have the tools to defend myself yet, and not a sign of things to come. I wasn't really looking for Aquaria - Super Kaizo World version.
This has always been something that has bugged me about fan made mods and such to games - not just Aquaria here, but pretty much anything - they often try to be *harder* than the original game instead of just offering more of what made the original game so good. I'm hoping that didn't happen here.
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I wasn't really looking for Aquaria - Super Kaizo World version.
Don't worry, this isn't the case, labyrinth isn't so hard. I did the final play through when i was kinda drunk, and I had no problems playing, if that counts.
The start isn't easy, I agree. Never ran out of food or anything, actually, you can enter the labyrinth with almost nothing and come back later with full pockets (unless you need to eat like crazy) :)
Meatymod took the crown of being the hardest mod ever, so unless you try that one, you're safe >:D
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Thanks for the feedback, Aristobolus! I wanted the difficulty of the first map to be about the same as the lower levels of the Veil. I figured people would have finished the main game and would find that level to be tolerable. Of course you have to find a couple of songs and costumes to help yourself out. Be sure to read the Aquarian messages on each map, then things won't seem so aimless. (And Naija can outrun the wurms!)
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Oh, definitely - I keep a noteback on hand for translating Aquarian messages - I haven't found any yet, but I am glad to hear you included some. One of my favorite things about Aquaria has always been the atmosphere, so if you can keep that in this mod, you're golden for me. That's why I'm playing - not so much in the sheer gameplay of being challenged or something, but just the experience of exploring a new, exotic world, and how alive Aquaria - and Naija - can seem. So again, if your mod has all these background touches and attention to detail to bring it to life, I should love it.
I really do pretty firmly believe the beginning is too difficult though. You shouldn't even be able to run into all these enemies before you can so much as sing a shield song. You say you wanted it to be as difficult as the Veil, but when you get to the Veil, you have certain tools at your disposal that aren't present here - this is definitely harder because of that.
Edit - I've played a bit more. Some more thoughts - I really enjoy that the treasures you placed around, when you find them, they actually show up somewhere around Naija/Li's new home. I suppose it's entirely possible you could've just had them disappear into the void, so it's cool that just like in the main game, you can flesh out her home as you find more stuff.
So far, I've found 3 treasures - the Mithalas Doll/Pot, and the Turtle egg. Also found the Shield song, but I don't know where I picked that up - I only noticed I even had it because I was looking through my menu. If I was supposed to get a notification that Naija had just learned the shield spell, I didn't. That might be a glitch - if it isn't, if possible, you might want to put in a notice somehow to alert the player they just got a song?
Even if it's something like, when you enter the place with the song, Naija makes a comment to herself about being reminded of whatever song you're about to get.
And, I really do think the map is just too aimless - it doesn't guide you anywhere, there's no real sense of direction at all. I never got this lost and annoyed at not being able to find things in normal Aquaria, and I've swam around in so many circles that I'm already getting bored. I found an Aquarian message but it just told me in blunt terms that there are x amount of treasures/songs/costumes/eggs to find, no real hint at actually finding them anywhere.
The map direction is that it's basically laid out in a giant spiral, so you're kindof naturally funneled along in a circular pattern, but this means lots of repetition and going in circles and places you've already been.
I don't mean to be this negative on it, but these are just my honest impressions and feelings, and I'm trying to give most helpful and constructive criticism I can. I love the visuals and touches you've made to the world, but I feel like mechanical problems are stopping me from enjoying it all.
Oh, also, a possible glitch or just a bit of sequence breaking you might want to fix - I traveled up the tunnel to this path of bubbles that eventually led me to the Mithalan pot treasure, but my first time through I missed a bubble and fell - but I fell down into a cavern where the only way in and out was blocked by a rock I would've had to lift with the bind song, except I didn't have the bind song. I had to use the editor to get out. Also, when I fell in there, I landed in a part of the water absolutely consumed by anemones and almost died before Naija just got richocheted into a part of the water I could actually control her - she would hit one, bounce into the air, land on another, and repeat.
I would suggest either placing a ceiling over this so you can't fall in there from the bubble path, or place a rock in the way blocking the route to the bubble path, so that you can't possibly get there without having bind, meaning if you fall in that cavern, you can use bind to get out.
Also with the bubble path, there's one bubble about midway through you're in, where you simply can not see the next bubble you have to jump to, and it's a leap of faith. You should probably move the bubbles slightly closer together so that you never have to make a blind jump, especially if you're careful.
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It's true, you do have to swim fast and do a LOT of dodging until you find shield and two of the costumes! ;D
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It's true, you do have to swim fast and do a LOT of dodging until you find shield and two of the costumes! ;D
That's not really fair to ask of the player if you want difficulty at all similar to the main story, though. They only placed obstacles in your way you could fairly deal with - Home Waters is a safe area not just because you're new to the game the first time you're there, but because you simply do not have the tools to reliably deal with the enemies you face.
The main Aquaria mode never throws you into situations that you simply can't handle.
I understand that you're expecting people to be more knowledgeable in the game than they are the first time they loaded Aquaria, but that doesn't mean you can just say, take enemies from the Veil and place them in the starting area because you know the player has already encountered those enemies before - yes, you can expect the player to know how to deal with these enemies, but you're not giving them the tools to deal with them as they know how from main Aquaria.
I feel like, a lot of the mistakes in design here are probably due to just how much time and effort you spent on making it - it's a double edged sword, basically. You were *so* invested in this, and you clearly did care - the time and effort you spent on this does show through - but you spent so much time on it that you got used to the map. You knew it by heart, you knew were everything was, and you likely forgot what it's like for a new player to be thrust into your map, that doesn't know where everything was.
It's the same kind of mistake old dungeon crawlers and text adventure games made all the time. Things like King's Quest and such - there's a solution, that the devs were thinking of, and it makes sense, but it's not really something that might come naturally to a player that doesn't have the knowledge the devs do, so the player can spend a lot more time, with a lot more trouble and frustration, than the devs did or expected or intended.
Also, I edited my other post with some more thoughts.
Edit - And I'm writing so much on this because the mod so far seems to have a lot of sheer effort and thought put into it, it has a lot of potential and it's not just some garbage mod I want to discard. Since it's very clear there was a lot of effort put into making it, I want to put effort into criticizing it. Something with this kind of potential I really would like to see be as good as it possibly can be.
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Also found the Shield song, but I don't know where I picked that up - I only noticed I even had it because I was looking through my menu. If I was supposed to get a notification that Naija had just learned the shield spell, I didn't. That might be a glitch - if it isn't, if possible, you might want to put in a notice somehow to alert the player they just got a song?
Arg, so it's indeed a glitch - there's a comment when you find a song. Don't know which version you used, but I got a reports for my version as well. So it's a glitch in loading savegames, that automatically adds shield on load (because the main game does so).
Oh, also, a possible glitch or just a bit of sequence breaking you might want to fix - I traveled up the tunnel to this path of bubbles that eventually led me to the Mithalan pot treasure, but my first time through I missed a bubble and fell - but I fell down into a cavern where the only way in and out was blocked by a rock I would've had to lift with the bind song, except I didn't have the bind song. I had to use the editor to get out. Also, when I fell in there, I landed in a part of the water absolutely consumed by anemones and almost died before Naija just got richocheted into a part of the water I could actually control her - she would hit one, bounce into the air, land on another, and repeat.
This isn't a glitch - this is intended. The rock is blocking that passage from the left, but you can still enter from the right. There's something imporant to find in the pond near the anemones...
Might thin out the anemones a bit, though...
Also with the bubble path, there's one bubble about midway through you're in, where you simply can not see the next bubble you have to jump to, and it's a leap of faith. You should probably move the bubbles slightly closer together so that you never have to make a blind jump, especially if you're careful.
Which resolution do you use? Wide or 4:3? Because the mod was designed on widescreen, maybe that's why. I'm also using widescreen, so if there's anything related to this I haven't noticed during testing.
EDIT: I'll make some minor changes today; Frances is fine with that. Haven't gotten much criticism yet, so there wasn't much to change so far, except a few bugs.
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I guess I use 4:3, I'm not actually sure.
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So, done a bit of tweaking, reduced anemone density in that specific place, and added partial world maps. Just have to talk to Frances to if everything is fine or if she isn't happy with my changes.
I also checked the bubble jumping part; set my resolution to 1024x768 (which is 4:3) and managed to do the full path from right to left and back, without ever falling down, and never had to do a blind jump anywhere (hint: use middle mouse button/wheel to look!).
The shield song bug is also fixed; but it's not a mod problem, so you'll get your fix as soon as i've made a new updatepack (will do tomorrow). You may wish to wait descending into the labyrinth until you have the update, because you won't have the shield song anymore as you've technically not learned it. I will also add a little hack to the mod to fix it for older versions.
EDIT: Nevermind, I can't add this hack because it would break other people's savegames. So just in case anyone runs into the problem that the next update takes shield away while you are in the labyrinth you can send me your save and i'll fix it up.
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Ah, I figured some things out from your post. My resolution is 1280x1024. That might still be 4:3 not sure. Anyway, my issue is a simple one - I forgot about the look function and was trying to see more bubbles by inching as close to the edge of a bubble as I could. I will point out that if you do this, there is a bubble where you can't see the next one.
I forgot about the look function because I don't think you ever really need to use it in the main Aquaria game.
How does a partial world map work, compared to the world map in the main game?
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Hey nice, thanks to this question I found another bug - it didn't load world map data when loading a mod's saved game. Fixed - in next updatepack. :)
The world map looks like this right now:
(http://fg.wzff.de/images/misc/aq/labyrinth_map01.jpg)
Not sure, maybe i've hidden too much... the first map is almost mapped out, and the other maps have some points that help orienting, but nothing of interest is in the mapped out locations. Thoughts?
You'll have to use map markers then, if you need to remember specific locations. That's what they're good for. ;)
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Your feedback has been good, Aristobulus. (I'm especially glad you pointed out the glitch with the shield song automatically appearing after a save.) Here's a little info about the mod:
The Main map was the first map I made when I was learning how to use the editor. The map kept growing larger as I wanted to try things out. At first I had no idea that there would even be other maps in the mod and as I was just learning, the main map has a little bit of many things that were in the main game - safe areas, dangerous areas, secret caves, hidden items, cliffs and water bubbles for jumping, and of course a variety of entities. When you start out, you are in the central area of the map near the central save point and close to the entrance to Naija's home. If you explore carefully, replenishing your health as needed with the save point and the strategically located health plants (which you can replenish by going in and out of the Garden warp point at the back of Naija's kitchen) you'll soon learn your way around. And if you want to find all the hidden items, of course you have to go everywhere, look at everything, and do a certain amount of backtracking. Especially if you're stocking up on food items, just as in the main game, there is backtracking. As far as it's being aimless, I suppose it is. This mod is all about exploring new environments and finding things, and your purpose in the Main map is to find the two songs and the costumes, and to stock up on food. There is a bit of a story later in the mod, but there's a lot of exploring to do first.
Spoilers:
The wurms: You can entice them away from the wurm caves, lead them to a neighboring area, and swim quickly around another way, leaving them behind. Then you are free to explore the wurm caves in peace.
The anemones: I agree that this area is obnoxious and you can die, and that's one of the things that will be made easier if another version of the mod comes out. But in the meantime, if you make a good leap off the top of the right-hand cliff into that cave, you should land cleanly between the two clumps of anemones. Once in the cave you can get out again even if you haven't yet found the bind song by climbing up the left hand cliff. Jump over the anemones, jump over the crab when he shows up, climb to the top, and you're out.
Other harmful entities - sharks, swordfish: Once you find the urchin costume you can kill them. Otherwise just dodge.
Believe it or not, I did try to put myself continuously in the place of a player while I was making Labyrinth mod, so it's good to hear what things worked for people and what didn't… Thanks!
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Wait, there wasn't THAT much dangerous stuff in the beginning, was there? All I remember that was particularly hard to avoid were sharks and swordfish. Swordfish are easy to dodge, and sharks don't have the best homing AI either. I think I got hurt when I was playing through the area in my LP some, but I'm a terrible player. And the area with worms was optional; I just avoided that place on my first time through.
I guess that is a good question, though: is this mod targeted at people who never played Aquaria before (Or at least never finished it), or at people who've played before? Because if it's for total newbies, it's fairly hard, but I personally was never able to get past Mithala without cheating, and I played through this mod in only a couple days, with 0 deaths. Ok, maybe 1 death. But it wasn't that hard for me.
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Uploaded new version with minor fixes.
And it has a world map!
The main area is almost completely mapped out, for an easier start, and the following areas almost not at all, with one exception.
This way you can use map markers, but no secrets are given away.
(@Aristobulus: Better now? Moar feedback please? :) )
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Sure. How do I get the newest version?
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Download mod from link in first post and use ;)
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Hey, I also completed this mod now, and wanted to leave some comments.
First of all, thanks for creating it... I really enjoyed it!
As for the above discussion about the intro map enemies being too difficult, I disagree. I found it quite easy to simply swim and jump around in such a way that they could not hit me. (And I don't even consider myself a good player...) Yes, swordfish can be annoying, but you can easily see when they're going to jump at you (they stand still for a second or so right before), so that's when you know that you need to dodge. Sharks aren't all that difficult, as long as you don't stay in the same horizontal line as them. And the giant wurms can be intimidating, but since you're faster than them I don't see the problem. (Also, once you find the bind song, you can fight them by dropping stones on their heads... ;D)
Aristobulus, is it possible that due to the original game you had become so accustomed to energy form that you had forgotten how to survive by simply dodging stuff? ;)
Also, if you're having trouble here, wait until you reach the "Depths" map (see below)... :-\
I do agree that the anemones can pose a challenge though. The first time I jumped off that cliff into the unknown, I landed right on the anemones, and got bounced off of them (without being able to do anything about it) ... right into some more anemones. Outch.
Anyways, the feedback I wanted to give about this mod:
1) What I especially liked
- Naijas's home. It's small and cozy, and actually feels like a home. In the original game, I was always annoyed by how big the home cave was - especially with all the extra rooms (or should I say halls) that got unlocked as you advanced in the game - and the treasures got spread out over all this vast space, which denied the player the satisfaction of seeing an overview of all found treasures close together. Not so in this mod.
- The "Rapids" map. I thought this was a really innovative and fun puzzle. And thanks to the strong currents and wormholes, each "try" through it was relatively quick, so it didn't become obnoxious to do many tries.
(Although I am wondering whether I missed anything useful, since one time I ended up in a dead-end that had a song plant, so maybe there were more songplants or costumes there that I missed?)
- The "Strange" map. This was simply awesome. Beautiful graphics, lots of fun jumping opportunities, an abundance of strange "fish" (they dropped fish meat and oil, so I think I can call them that... ;)), and an interesting boss fight (where it's not immediately clear how you can even have a chance to defeat him, but once you figure it out it's quite doable). Also, this map really put the fun in wearing the Urchin costume (which I never found much use for in the original game)...
- The zoom spots in the main "Wheel" map. Great idea, and well executed.
- The background graphics in the "Pearlmine" map. Various places in this map gave a really cool "depth" feeling, like you're actually in a big 3D world. No place in the original game achieved that so well.
2) What I found (positively) surprising
- Ok, this is not so much about the game itself but rather about my experience with it. When I first started exploring the central "Wheel" map, I thought I would never be able to find my way around it, and it would be one long, tiring journey of trial and error 'til the end. But by the end of the mod, I suddenly realized I had come to "know" that area quite naturally and could quite accurately find my way to specific points of interest without even putting much thought into it. A rather nice learning experience...
3) What I found a little irritating
- The rukh nest in the intro map - because it did not leave a "rukh egg" ingredient like the two rukh nests in the main game do... :(
- The section in the main "Wheel" map that was filled with Nudibranchs. Ok, maybe I'm simply angry at myself because for some reason it took me quite some time (and several deaths) to solve that "puzzle". But even once I had figured out how to do it, it was a tedious task to actually execute (a long way of swimming back to various earlier points, and returning) . Couldn't that puzzle have been more locally confined? I.e. only a short tunnel section filled with Nudibranchs, with both sides of it easily reachable without having to swim for 10 Minutes (accounting for getting lost along the way)?
- The Octopus boss fight. In most boss fights in Aquaria you 1. need to figure out how you can damage him, 2. plan how exactly your'e going move and what steps you're going to take (e.g. jump back and forth between specific spots, swim around him in a specific direction, damage him at very specific times etc.), and 3. execute it three or so times until he gets mad, then 4. blast his eyes. If you didn't follow your well-planned steps for how to move/act, you would usually get killed fast. If you did, you would win.
In this mod's octopus fight, on the other hand, I couldn't figure out any such steps - the octopus simply moved around and used his weapons too erratically. On the other hand, he seemed to have much fewer hit points and would do less damage with his lasers then the Aquaria-bosses. So it degenerated into just a messy close-range hustle between me, my bound rock, and the octopus - with me simply accepting his laser damage and offsetting it with health recipes. When he died, it just wasn't the same feeling of satisfaction as after a carefully planned and successfully executed Aquaria boss kill.
4) What I found a little irritating, but in a way also kind of fun ^-^
- The "Depths" map.
The sheer number of nasty enemies in this map was just... crazy :-) I found it completely impossible to do any systematic exploration of the map - I became so preoccupied with dodging missiles and running from predators that I pretty much lost my sense of space and just jumped across caves, tunnels and wormholes aimlessly (often ending up in the same spot repeatedly)... When I came across an energy shot door and associated "ball", I was actually beginning to think I had made a mistake and should have found energy form before entering this map... It took quite few more minutes of frantic swimming around before I reached a savepoint, and yet more before I at last found the "magic wormhole chamber" that would allow me to solve the map...
(Btw, once I had energy form, I systematically cleaned out the whole map, leaving no monster alive, just out of revenge... >:D (ok, also for the song plants))
5) What I found a little cheesy
- The "recipe refill" room at the bottom of the "Wheel" map.
You could just go back and forth between that room and the jelly fish room right outside it, and they would both restock everytime so you could easily get as many leafs, eggs, red bulbs, jelly oil, etc. as you want. The kitchen was also near, making it possible to make full use of those ingredients... Of course I couldn't resist (I even took a trip back to the "Strange" map, to stock up on meat and oil (and recipes based on them), just so I could make use of all those leaves and eggs...) but in retrospect it made the game a little cheesy.
- The last boss fight (after getting energy shot).
Maybe I am myself to blame (for having stacked up so many recipes), but this wasn't so much a fight, as it was me eating some Energy shot +2, Speed +2 and Regeneration +1 items, and then jumping around and continually hitting the [CTRL] button like crazy without much tactical consideration. After some time I got blinded (screen turned into rainbow spiral) - I don't even know what caused it, I guess I was hit by some projectile - and when the screen turned normal again, I noticed all enemies had already died in the meantime and I could stop hitting [CTRL]... ::)
Again, all things considered I really enjoyed playing this mod, so thanks again for creating it!
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Wow, thanks for this really thorough feedback, archy. It was so fun to read about the parts you liked! :D And it's good to know about the parts you found irritating or cheesy…
I'll comment on a couple of those:
The Ruhk egg: I did want an egg to be available there, but the ruhk has to be killed to produce the egg, and without energy form I'm not sure that's possible. However, it occurred to me while walking my dog this morning (a good time to think about games and mods) that perhaps with hot soup and the urchin costume Naija could jump high enough to hit the ruhk enough times to kill her. The other possibility would be some additional scripting. By the time False.Genesis started helping with scripts I was working on the Pearlmine, and never thought about going back to the ruhk and asking him to modify that script. Spoiler: There is a ruhk egg elsewhere in the mod, in the Rapids map. Directions are not given in the Aquarian notation; it's a reward for exploring everywhere.
The "nudi" section of the Wheel map: You make a good point about it being a pain to backtrack once you figure out what you have to do. The other thing I wished I had done here, but didn't think of in time, was to have one of the scrying lenses right by the nudies so you could see the whole thing at once and plan your strategy.
The Depths map: One of the testers (@achurch) told me he had a great time setting it up in each area so that the enemies pretty much eliminated each other...
The recipe room at the bottom of the Wheel map: Well, yes, that is a bit "cheesy" or "leafy" or something! I just like to make food, and I thought like-minded players could have fun here. I guess I did overdo it a bit. :P
Thanks again for this thoughtful feedback!
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There's a puzzle involved in finding energy form, and once you've found it, you have the means to leave the map. Be sure to search everywhere; you'll know the puzzle room when you see it. Beast form is your friend on this map - you can eat many of the enemies. :D
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The Ruhk egg: I did want an egg to be available there, but the ruhk has to be killed to produce the egg, and without energy form I'm not sure that's possible.
I don't think I ever actually killed a ruhk in the original game. I just shot at it until it would flee and drop an egg. (In this mod, I simply jumped at it, which also successfully scared it away but did not cause it do drop the egg.) You might be right though that it is the damage you give to the ruhk, not the fact that you scare it away, which causes the egg to be dropped...
The Depths map: One of the testers (@achurch) told me he had a great time setting it up in each area so that the enemies pretty much eliminated each other...
Beast form is your friend on this map - you can eat many of the enemies. :D
Interesting... I didn't try either of those things very much while in that map. Might have to go back and give it another try...
The recipe room at the bottom of the Wheel map: Well, yes, that is a bit "cheesy" or "leafy" or something!
Come to think of it, the original game has a similar spot: In the north-eastern Kelp Forest map, there was a large rock at the center with a (somewhat hidden) cave inside in which you could get many many leaves and red bulbs, and outside of the cave, there was a cove with two jellyfish nearby, so you could go back and forth between the two similar to the room in this mod. Although, of course...
- you wouldn't get many eggs there - you'd have to travel to a completely different map (open waters) to restock on those
- the cave was more convoluted and a longer, so it would take longer to "harvest" all the ingredients
- there was no kitchen nearby
- there were several enemies right outside of the cave, which would respawn each time as well... so you'd have to be more careful (although the sea dragon could actually be seen as part of the food-restocking system, as he was afaik the only way other than song plants to get a special bulb ;))
On the other hand, there were additionally some fish swarms nearby for meat and oil.
I just like to make food
So do I, which you can probably deduce from my own contribution (http://www.bit-blot.com/forum/index.php?topic=3804.0) to the Aquaria community... ;D
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So do I, which you can probably deduce from my own contribution to the Aquaria community... ;D
Wow, I wish I had seen this; it would have made balancing out the song bulb ingredients for the whole mod much easier! :P
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I figured I'd pop in again to let everyone know that I finished my LP of the mod. YouTube playlist: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utewI-zmdxo&list=PLF17ACDF4D514BBBC&index=1&feature=plpp_video
Thanks!
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Update on Kuirlins - latest discoveries
Kuirlins are amphibious; they breath underwater when swimming, and in air when in their houses. Like some other creatures in Aquaria they can change form at will - in their case, from an aquatic non- legged form to a terrestrial form with short, powerful legs. In both forms they are excellent jumpers.
Kuirlins maintain the air in their dwellings by extracting dissolved oxygen from the water by a process using the kuirlin plants, which grow on and around their houses. Each house contains its own extraction apparatus, generally kept in the lower part of the building. Their spherical houses form loose semi-attached aggregations in several areas around and about the waters of Aquaria.
After the rescue of the town in Labyrinth Mod from the clutches of the cruel pearl mine octopus, the mayor felt so grateful to Naija that he commissioned a portrait of her from an artist friend. Here is the mayor relaxing in his house:
(http://fg.wzff.de/images/misc/aq/labyrinth/kuirlinhouse2forweb.jpg) (http://fg.wzff.de/images/misc/aq/labyrinth/kuirlinhouse2.png)
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This coming weekend marks a year since the release of Labyrinth Mod. Coincidentally, there have been 365 downloads from the forum link! It's been fun following the download stats -- not all show origin, but those that do are from 37 countries on six continents. Countries with more than one download:
United States 84
Russian Federation 46 (courtesy of a link from KS-10's website)
Germany 35
Poland 18
France 15
Canada 11
Australia 10
United Kingdom 8
Italy 7
Israel 6
Thailand 4
Slovakia 4
Sweden 4
Brazil 3
Turkey 3
Czech Republic 3
Korea, Republic of 3
Belgium 2
Netherlands 2
Portugal 2
Serbia 2
New Zealand 2
Romania 2
Chile 2
Indonesia 2
Spain 2
Ukraine 2
Downloads have been fairly evenly distributed throughout the year, and are still happening at the rate of about one a day. In addition, from ModDB there have been 67 downloads to date.
I haven't played through Labyrinth since releasing it, but am doing an anniversary play-through this weekend. (No doubt I'll see lots of places where improvements could be made. :P )
Thanks to everyone who played; I hope you had fun... And thanks especially to those who sent feedback. You don't know how appreciated and valuable it is. :D
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Congrats! And thanks for the stats, love them! :)
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Really great mod! The part with the dragonflies and all the plant stalks ranks right up there with Ice Veil as one of my favorite parts of Aquaria, even if it's non-canon (haha).
Also, the name of the mod is completely accurate to the gameplay. Mazes all the way, but nevertheless, extremely well done.
I had to screenshot pieces of the main labyrinth and put them together to figure out how to get out of the place. My thanks to fgenesis and everyone else who helped me when I got lost.
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Sooooo...I've spent about the last three days just shotgunning this mod, since I realized I never actually got past the first area all those years ago (chalk it up to Mass Effect 3 coming out around that time...:P), so now I'm ready to give my full feedback!
(Note: I'm still not sure if I'm completely "finished" with the mod yet, since I'm still in the Wheel part but just got Fish Form...and that's about 5 and a half hours in, so I feel I gotta be coming up to the end soonish.)
Not sure if the original creator is still lurking on the forums or whatnot...but eh. Might as well throw my two cents into the fountain.
- The new areas look absolutely GORGEOUS. Especially the "Strange" area of the mod, which really looks like everything in a greenish-lilipad pond scaled up by about a thousand...even the parts of the pond we don't see. The microbe-looking things, the giant dragonflies, the huge tadpoles, the clusters of spores in little nets that make Naija giggle when you break the nets open...all of it looks so cool, and so beautiful. The mines were pretty cool, too, and I loved the attention to detail in the home waters. And the Depths part was equal parts dark/foreboding and bright/alien, especially the room with all the colored pods that had portals that led to different arenas. It reminded me of that alien dimensional thingy from Pacific Rim...which is pretty cool.
- I really liked this mod's approach to combat. In the main game (and in several other mods as well), your combat options for most of the game were Energy form...and that's about it, until you got Dual Form. All the other forms were more-or-less useless in combat, as the average player would just stick to Energy Form in combat scenarios and only switch to Beast/Nature/Sun form when the situation required it. In this mod, though, it's completely inverted: you're not given Energy Form until the tail end of the maze, but you're still given plenty of weapons up until then, like the Urchin Armor, or the Nature Form thorn plants. This forced me to try new things and keep experimenting, employing strategies I'd never use if I had Energy form from the start. Under fire from a Sea Dragon? Sing the Shield Song, dash and grab the beast while wearing the Urchin armor, and ride its back until it dies. Being chased by poisonous worms or relentless nautiluses? Switch to Nature Form, drop a cactus behind you, and laugh as they ram headfirst into the spiky thorns and die. Trapped in a room with lots of projectile-spitting, wall-crawling enemies? Switch to Beast Form and eat and eat and eat and eat...and get ammo for their abilities that you can unleash on the next big tough monster. It's all really rewarding, and helped me develop strategies that I'll bring with me into the main game.
-That said, however, the difficulty felt incredibly frustrating at times. This mainly has to do with how Aquaria handles death; if you die, you just get sent back to the last Save Point, all progress since then lost. And while the Save Points are plentiful in this mod...the tough, murderous enemies are even more plentiful. And all it takes is one mistake, one mistimed dash, one little projectile you never even noticed...and then bam. Game over. I found this incredibly frustrating, even with the generous save points, the generous food supplies, and the generous combat opportunities. And why, why, why, why, why, why, WHY are there giant worms in the beginning area?!? On that note: putting heavy-hitting, quick-acting, can-kill-you-in-a-minute-if-they-get-it enemies in Song Bulbs was just mean. >:(
Overall, though, I liked the Labyrinth Mod. It's a lot more cerebral than other game mods I've played for other games, but I appreciated that. It's gorgeous, engaging, and for the most part, fun. Loved it!
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Thanks for the feedback, Joey – it made my day to know someone still played Labyrinth mod and liked it enough to give pretty detailed, generous feedback. As for the mod's difficulty, I think by the end I was somewhat influenced by F.genesis who was helping at that time with the scripts. And if you think this was hard, try playing his Meaty Mod!
Yep, I still check the forum fairly often, because I'm one of the folks working on the "Something Like a Sequel" mod. And I frequently lurk/hang out on the bit blot IRC channel as Fawpaw. We're approaching the completion of the first chapter of the sequel mod, so it's fun times. :D
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Wow – five years on and Labyrinth Mod finally reached 1000 downloads! I almost missed it as I only check the stats on Bitly occasionally nowadays. The last download that put the number over the top was from Canada. I can only see a fraction of the stats that Bitly used to show since they reorganized, but extrapolating from past data the top countries for downloads after five years are the US, Russia, Germany, and Canada.
Making Labyrinth Mod still ranks among the most enjoyable and immersive projects I've ever engaged in. Kudos to Alex and Derek not only for making Aquaria (best game ever imo), but for providing the editor, allowing even amateur, non-programmers like myself to experience the fun of making a game. :D